[Karen37a]

People always think that somehow "salespeople" can be replaced. Save the time energy, research and nay-saying.They can't.

From the dawn of ages various companies in various industries have tried to figure out a away to get the "best leads " "best prospects" automate systems, cut out the huge commission and the need for top agents etc.

If it could be done, which it cant, the big funders would do it themselves and cut out the middle man and the HIGH commissions.

Nothing replaces a great sales person. One who can actually sell. One that uses a pulling technique , not a pushing one. Who actually LISTENS to his/her client and tries to get the best deal for THEIR personal situation regardless of any personal monetary gain using a consultative selling approach.

They have a saying.."Even a blind squirrel can find a nut " They blind squirrels will always be in the business, and trying to over-saturate it. They wont last. Like the movie Glengarry glen ross said...they will be sitting in a bar one day drinking a beer, after their 9-5 job which they hate saying " i used to be a salesman, its a tough racket "

I was told a longgggggggggg time ago(25-30 years ago) when I worked in the health club industry as a sales manager of a gym ; by a head of the new firm that bought them out,( and they got bought out a few times, or passed around ) " Why should we pay little girls in exercise tights 50k to sign up people to join the gym? We can just put a visa mastercard machine in the lobby and people can choose Gold/Silver/Bronze membership.." I just smiled laughed at him and went to wall st to work the next day.

True sales people get paid the big bucks because they can do what other people and advertising can not.

The most important thing .........Close sales, without being a pushy arrogant Pr***, and build relationships

[Karen37a]

Now I need to get on the phone because some of you pay more taxes than I make : )

See you at the top

[jotucker1983]

Karen,

I agree with you in theory, but there's different types of sales people and certain types of sales people are being replaced (and have already been replaced).

The one type of sales person that I think will never be replaced is the "Sales Professional", this is not the guy that just regurgitates canned scripts and canned procedures, to a large mass amount of prospective clients. This is the guy that has to bring much more to the table in terms of a specialized skill set such as:

- Full understanding on complex systems, technologies, platforms, and markets

- The ability to diagnose actual current complex issues and upcoming issues

- The ability to prescribe and tailor complex solutions to complex unique merchant situations and structures

- The ability to conduct complex market research, networking and strategic partnership structuring

A "robot" will never be able to do this. Thus, a true Sales Professional will always be in demand across industries that have complex solutions for complex merchant situations.

Now, when the solutions are not as complex and the issues are not as complex, then those sales people can be replaced most times through some form of automation. For example, Retail sales people are being replaced by such forms of automation/technology. Certain sales people in the Financial Services industry are being replaced by such forms of automation/technology (life insurance agents for example).

I think it comes down to the complexity of the sales process, which includes the complexity of the merchant's problem and the complexity of creating the solution to said problem.

[fundgorilla]

I don't mind the competition because it casts my talents and differences into sharper relief. I do believe we are in for a headcount reduction, and perhaps more regulation, and at that time I suggest that the crowd which trampled from stocks to mortgages to cash advances will be off on another quixotic adventure. I'm always trying to speculate where that is headed in order to make money off of it, but my magic 8 ball is not delivering on this one.

[FUNd]

Not sure jumping into a biz with low overhead and high returns can be described as quixotic, but 2 points for the vocabulary.

[MCNetwork]

It's quixotic for all the ISOs and lenders with limited experience who jumped on the bandwagon within the last 12 months. If you don't really know what you're doing, you'll be eaten alive.

[fundgorilla]

Not sure jumping into a biz with low overhead and high returns can be described as quixotic, but 2 points for the vocabulary.

My email open rate is far and away the leader - probably on a national level. I should get paid just to write subject lines.

[Karen37a]

I agree....butttttt

I am one of those penny stock brokers turned real broker, turned mortgage broker who jumped shipped right before both crashes.

The magic 8 ball hinted for me to do so. I took the advice of long ago investor gurus.(What they said made sense to me as i was living thru it; going to cocktail parties and every idiot with their pedantic , verbose, semantics ( 3 points for stringing those words together ) , telling me about quantitative and qualitative analysis and csco.

Bernard Baruch and Joe Kennedy who reportedly said...

" when the shoe shine boy is giving you tips its time to leave the market " meaning if its so over-saturated, there is no one left to sell to.

The shoe shine boys are not giving me tips yet although I have seen this forum attack a few who are trying to get skin into the game, some who have no clue as to whats going on.

You have to give them an A plus for trying..You cant learn to ride a bike from a book only experience (sometimes bad) teaches certain lessons.

[Karen37a]

And true Salespeople cannot be replaced. Order takers /telemarketing agents disguised as sales people can.

[FUNd]

The shoe shine boys are not giving me tips yet although I have seen this forum attack a few who are trying to get skin into the game, some who have no clue as to whats going on.

I'll bite. What's going on?

[Karen37a]

If I really knew what was going on I wouldn't be in the Cash Advance Industry ! : ) ...Id be sailing on my Yacht off the coast of Monaco


Pssst Fund " I'll bite. What's going on?"


You cant draw me into a gun battle without a Gun....nice try though

[FUNd]

If I really knew what was going on I wouldn't be in the Cash Advance Industry ! : ) ...Id be sailing on my Yacht off the coast of Monaco


Pssst Fund " I'll bite. What's going on?"


You cant draw me into a gun battle without a Gun....nice try though

Fair enough.

[bdshaw]

Fair enough.

If the space is over saturated why not expand your personal space by learning about other financial products and markets. The banks seem to have expanded to B to B companies why not follow suit and offer other products those companies might need.
It's not that difficult to learn enough about ABL, factoring, or equipment leasing to be able to solicit business although you will find that in many cases you customer is more financially knowledgeable.
However, to be successful requires a working knowledge of the products and their applicability.

[jotucker1983]

If the space is over saturated why not expand your personal space by learning about other financial products and markets. The banks seem to have expanded to B to B companies why not follow suit and offer other products those companies might need.
It's not that difficult to learn enough about ABL, factoring, or equipment leasing to be able to solicit business although you will find that in many cases you customer is more financially knowledgeable.
However, to be successful requires a working knowledge of the products and their applicability.

I could be wrong, but I just think that the future for independent sales agents is very dark and only those independent sales agents with significant competitive advantages will not just survive, but thrive.

I just don't think the guy pushing out of the box solutions that his "ISO" offers to a list of SIC Codes, will make it anymore and he would be better off working full time at the Wendy's drive-thru window than following that strategy.

The independent offices (no matter if it's one guy or multiple) are going to need strategic/exclusive networks, partnerships, data, insider knowledge, and products to win. You would be a specialist within a particular market that has identified issues/challenges that you can address, without there being a lot of "competition" calling on said market to address said issues/challenges. You can't get to this point without strategic networks, research, data, knowledge and products.

In other words, while you might be a "small guy", you better be operating similar to that of the big guy (who operates based on strategic/exclusive networks) rather than operating like the traditional sales agent who sells out of the box solutions to a generic list of SIC Codes.

[TheShitzuofMCA]

Agreed, the industry has been slow this Jewish holiday for example (according to most ISO shops)...Yet we cant deal with the rush of all the 1st position deals calling us for capital, merchants new to the industry. Its nicer to educate merchants on the product than talk to a merchant on a UCC sheet or one that's been stacked. Rare the merchant that leaves with a good experience after being stacked to death. I feel like there are still so many people who don't know about an MCA, why are most ISO's fighting over the same leads instead of doing the hard work and originating. It takes time, effort, and money but it pays off we have seen.

[YuliyaG]

If my sources are correct, the "Disney World for indie brokers" (for leads) is coming in Q4.... If it's executed... decent leads will become a lot more accessible for a lot more people.

[FUNd]

Agreed, the industry has been slow this Jewish holiday for example (according to most ISO shops)...Yet we cant deal with the rush of all the 1st position deals calling us for capital, merchants new to the industry. Its nicer to educate merchants on the product than talk to a merchant on a UCC sheet or one that's been stacked. Rare the merchant that leaves with a good experience after being stacked to death. I feel like there are still so many people who don't know about an MCA, why are most ISO's fighting over the same leads instead of doing the hard work and originating. It takes time, effort, and money but it pays off we have seen.

I know I bring this up often, but you're implying ISO's aren't working hard and originating, and we are somehow missing out on the copious amount of qualified '1st position' MCA virgins out there that seem to knocking down your door. I for one, spend a lot of money to attract the attention of new clients, and I love when I get the pleasure of speaking to a merchant who has never heard of me or my product.

Further, I am friendly with or acquaintances of some other ISO owners in the area here and they spend and employ far more than we do. The ROI on the marketing they use is still very thin, while the acquisition cost remains well into the low 4 figure range. Some have to depend on the renewal just to turn a profit right now, mostly because of market saturation. Any ISO spouting they would not consider giving a 2nd or even 3rd, in some cases, to a qualified, well-underwritten merchant, is crazy.

I guess what I'm saying is that we do originate, and we do work hard. Where is this honeypot of virgins you speak of, and how do we reach them? Privately share this with me, and you get the first right of refusal on every application I bring in. Deal?

[FUNd]

If my sources are correct, the "Disney World for indie brokers" (for leads) is coming in Q4.... If it's executed... decent leads will become a lot more accessible for a lot more people.

Can you please share some more details? Q4 starts in 6 days.

Hasn't the "Disney World for indie brokers" already tried and failed, when the big players came along and drove the lead cost and PPC up so high, the small and mid size guys couldn't buy them anymore?

[Zach]

I've always found that partnering with quality referral partners in related fields (insurance, factoring, equipment financing, accountants, bookkeepers, etc) tends to generate the highest-quality leads. Often times their referrals are complete laydowns because they have no familiarity with our space at all. If you have enough operating capital to sustain yourself and enough patience, I recommend to call referral partners all day instead of end-users.

Albeit not a quick fix, in the long run a strong referral network is incredibly valuable... Leverage their sales force while you build your own.

[jotucker1983]

FUNd,

I can't rep you enough, there should be a button to rep a post two, three or four times (we could call it the Reputation Stack lol).

I also keep hearing about how there's this open market of merchants out here who have never took out an advance, and for some reason that alone is supposed to mean there's this opportunity to convert a large amount of people to new clients? The reality is that the reason they have never taken out an advance (or an alt. loan), is because the cost is too damn high lol!

With all of the marketing going on out here, companies being featured in the media, etc., I would say that the vast majority of small business owners have heard about this product in one form or another.

I think we have to just be honest with ourselves and admit, we really are fighting over the business (in the US at least) of no more than 25,000 - 35,000 merchants today. We are literally just flinging the same merchant to this company, then to that company, then to another company.

These aren't your every day business owners, these merchants (sorry to say) are usually unsophisticated, their credit scores are much lower than the national average, they are unorganized like hell, you need 3 months of bank statements from them and they can't keep all of the pages together, they don't file their taxes on time, or they don't pay their rent on time, they send you over expired driver's licenses, etc., etc. These are the people that our product appeals to, it's the unsophisticated. And I'm sorry to say that.

The "normal" everyday entrepreneur, that's organized and sophisticated, literally laughs at these MCA post cards or "voicemails" they receive about 1.20 - 1.45 factor rates over 6 - 12 months. They aren't going to ever entertain our product.

[lkc67]

Unfortunately, the next big thing will be reduced commissions and increased competition.

I don't think that reduced commissions are the next big thing, have you seen the new commission promotion from Everest Business Funding - 13% base plus volume incentives on top for all new deals funded. This promotion runs for the entire 4th Qtr.

Contact us for the details - iso.support@ev-bf.com or call 888-342-5709

[cardinalequity]

Jotucker1983: As much as I appreciate your usual well written and sophisticated posts, I completely disagree. Perception is projection and I can assure you not only are the stats of businesses much larger than quoted but there is absolutely a very large percentage of small business that we speak to that have not heard of this sort of funding. I think the distinction is based on how you(meaning brokers) are locating these merchants. (UCC, etc) Logically if everyone came on DF and purchased leads from the same 5 marketing companies that come on here constantly soliciting then saturation inevitable.(Although I know many that still do well with UCC leads)

As a side bar I think lack of creativity and vision is one of the biggest obstacles for newer people in the space. Brokers ask, where can I get the best ucc leads, where do you go to send out the best mailers?!?? Everyone wants to duplicate, which at times works (why reinvest the wheel) however no one looks for the path less traveled and/or thinks outside the box. As I always say, all entrepreneurs can sell but not everyone that can sell is an entrepreneur. The big changes everyone is experiencing and/or will experience will definitely separate the wheat from the chaff.

[FUNd]

Jotucker1983: As much as I appreciate your usual well written and sophisticated posts, I completely disagree. Perception is projection and I can assure you not only are the stats of businesses much larger than quoted but there is absolutely a very large percentage of small business that we speak to that have not heard of this sort of funding. I think the distinction is based on how you(meaning brokers) are locating these merchants. (UCC, etc) Logically if everyone came on DF and purchased leads from the same 5 marketing companies that come on here constantly soliciting then saturation inevitable.(Although I know many that still do well with UCC leads)

As a side bar I think lack of creativity and vision is one of the biggest obstacles for newer people in the space. Brokers ask, where can I get the best ucc leads, where do you go to send out the best mailers?!?? Everyone wants to duplicate, which at times works (why reinvest the wheel) however no one looks for the path less traveled and/or thinks outside the box. As I always say, all entrepreneurs can sell but not everyone that can sell is an entrepreneur. The big changes everyone is experiencing and/or will experience will definitely separate the wheat from the chaff.

OK granted, then I want the numbers of these merchants that have never heard of an MCA. I will call them myself, and market the **** out of them. I have 2 million data records, sorted by SIC, NAICS, revenue, and location. Not UCC's. This is raw data. We market to a large percentage of this list on a quarterly basis through different means. It's very rare someone has never heard of "one of these high interest daily payment deals..."

Update: In the past day, I've seen 1 On Deck commercial, 20 internet banners, 5 talk radio working capital live reads, 2 square commercials, 2 robo calls, and a direct mail piece in my business mailbox for MCA (and I'm an ISO).

[MCNetwork]

I also keep hearing about how there's this open market of merchants out here who have never took out an advance, and for some reason that alone is supposed to mean there's this opportunity to convert a large amount of people to new clients? The reality is that the reason they have never taken out an advance (or an alt. loan), is because the cost is too damn high lol!

I think we have to just be honest with ourselves and admit, we really are fighting over the business (in the US at least) of no more than 25,000 - 35,000 merchants today. We are literally just flinging the same merchant to this company, then to that company, then to another company.

Can't disagree more with this statement. Every day, my team and I pitch solid approvals to merchants who know next to nothing about a merchant cash advance. For those companies that have no need for immediate capital, the ads and banners for cash advances just go over their heads and don't register with them. Once a bonafide need DOES arise however, many of them are ripe for the product and can barely recall the banners they saw a month ago. The only funders and ISOs that are fighting over the same 25,000-35,000 merchants are the UCC hunters. The firms that have a much larger marketing budget know how to find the virgin MCA clients.

[J.Celifarco]

Can't disagree more with this statement. Every day, my team and I pitch solid approvals to merchants who know next to nothing about a merchant cash advance. For those companies that have no need for immediate capital, the ads and banners for cash advances just go over their heads and don't register with them. Once a bonafide need DOES arise however, many of them are ripe for the product and can barely recall the banners they saw a month ago. The only funders and ISOs that are fighting over the same 25,000-35,000 merchants are the UCC hunters. The firms that have a much larger marketing budget know how to find the virgin MCA clients.

100% agree with you I pitch more people who have never heard of a loan that can be paid back with daily payments then I do merchants who have..

We see all those banners because of the websites we go too we are targetted with them based on internet activity. ABC pizza guy goes to a website he is probably not seeing an ondeck banner