[area1funding]

Anyone know the pros and cons for each?
How do these 2 match up?

[Davincinc]

who is headway? Bluevine is funded by celtic bank and its a real bank LOC, just with aprs fees almost double a true bank LOC

[ryan $]

Headway doesnt even take ISO's im pretty sure.

Kabbag, Bluevine and Fundbox are the LOC providers, OnDeck too. They all are in the same ballpark pricewise.

Par has a LOC program too, with 6 point upsell on a buy rate schedule. I like their program cause you can make the most.

Imagine if you had a BlueVine type product 1.12 Buy Rate and you could put whatever points on a 6 month term. Id love that, brokers would move that product like hot cakes. Add 15 point to a 1.12, 6 Month 1.27 weekly payment.....thats totally sellable

[WestCoastFunding]

Headway doesnt even take ISO's im pretty sure

They have a broker program, but the onboarding process is insane. Starts with a NDA and then moves on to a ton of forms to be completed before you then have to provide them with 2 years of your company’s audited financials.

[Money$Mike]

is there a number i can call you

[Atlas Financial]

Headway Capital is part of Enova International, which also owns The Business Backer and other online personal loan programs in Brazil and UK.

[RickyR3712]

They have a broker program, but the onboarding process is insane. Starts with a NDA and then moves on to a ton of forms to be completed before you then have to provide them with 2 years of your company’s audited financials.

A nice way of saying we are not interested

[Sachip24]

Headway pricing is MCA pricing except they go out longer up to 18 months I think with their program. As mentioned above they are owned by ENova which also owns Business Backer so I am sure BB has access to anyone you send to Headway.

[matt.estes]

Quick comparison (note - I'm obviously biased because I work at BlueVine):

- Max LOC size: Headway = $100k and BlueVine = $250k
- Frequency of repayment: Both Headway and BlueVine do weekly and monthly
- Max term length: Headway = 18 months and BlueVine = 12 months
- Speed: BlueVine faster than Headway
- Approval rate: BlueVine > Headway
- Pricing: Don't have great data here, but fair to assume roughly equivalent for apples-to-apples customers

Candidly, I don't often find us competing against Headway. More often, we're competing against a Kabbage offer that an ISO's client may have gotten a direct offer for (i.e. client applied directly on Kabbage web site) or against a term loan / MCA type product.

Matt Estes
BlueVine

[Kdonnellon]

As the head of the ISO Division for Headway (Enova) I'll chime in. As matt.estes said, I'm biased as well since I work for Headway.

- Speed: App to FIRM offer in 2-3 hours with the ability to approve customers instantly; Online Checkout which takes minutes to complete
- Repayment: Monthly on every deal
- Terms: Up to 24 months
- Interest accrual: Daily interest accrual; only pay for the days you keep the funds out
- Commissions: We pay 5% or more (depending on volume) on EVERY draw

We are launching new partners every week. I will admit several years ago our sign up process sucked; it was long and cumbersome. We're a public company and want to partner with the right people. But our process is significantly faster and easier than before.

[microboby]

Quick comparison (note - I'm obviously biased because I work at BlueVine):

- Max LOC size: Headway = $100k and BlueVine = $250k
- Frequency of repayment: Both Headway and BlueVine do weekly and monthly
- Max term length: Headway = 18 months and BlueVine = 12 months
- Speed: BlueVine faster than Headway
- Approval rate: BlueVine > Headway
- Pricing: Don't have great data here, but fair to assume roughly equivalent for apples-to-apples customers

Candidly, I don't often find us competing against Headway. More often, we're competing against a Kabbage offer that an ISO's client may have gotten a direct offer for (i.e. client applied directly on Kabbage web site) or against a term loan / MCA type product.

Matt Estes
BlueVine

Matt can you DM your contact to sign up as ISO? Need a true LOC ASAP on my product offerings, have files ready

Thanks

[area1funding]

Thanks you all for the info!

[Sachip24]

Quick comparison (note - I'm obviously biased because I work at BlueVine):

- Max LOC size: Headway = $100k and BlueVine = $250k
- Frequency of repayment: Both Headway and BlueVine do weekly and monthly
- Max term length: Headway = 18 months and BlueVine = 12 months
- Speed: BlueVine faster than Headway
- Approval rate: BlueVine > Headway
- Pricing: Don't have great data here, but fair to assume roughly equivalent for apples-to-apples customers

Candidly, I don't often find us competing against Headway. More often, we're competing against a Kabbage offer that an ISO's client may have gotten a direct offer for (i.e. client applied directly on Kabbage web site) or against a term loan / MCA type product.

Matt Estes
BlueVine

I don't know about that approval rate....

[Nunya]

This is a very informational thread. We should do more of these head-to-heads.

[omegafund]

Bluevine's UW model is hard to work with. It all depends on their computer and "risk" ...

[matt.estes]

Bluevine's UW model is hard to work with. It all depends on their computer and "risk" ...

I don't completely disagree, Omegafund. It can feel black-boxy at times because of the automation. But we do our best to communicate underwriting standards upfront and decline reasons after the fact.

That said...we can give you good guidelines on FICO, monthly deposits, ending daily balance, and existing leverage where you'll see 70%+ average approval rates if you hit the guidelines.

Happy to discuss more 1:1 if you think it would be helpful.

[brokerCompany]

I don't completely disagree, Omegafund. It can feel black-boxy at times because of the automation. But we do our best to communicate underwriting standards upfront and decline reasons after the fact.

That said...we can give you good guidelines on FICO, monthly deposits, ending daily balance, and existing leverage where you'll see 70%+ average approval rates if you hit the guidelines.

Happy to discuss more 1:1 if you think it would be helpful.

Hi Matt been waiting 2 days for your UW to get back to me on a deal. THE UW did not understand that merchant got paid by banks clients.... Let me know to discuss. My manager will reach out

[omegafund]

I don't completely disagree, Omegafund. It can feel black-boxy at times because of the automation. But we do our best to communicate underwriting standards upfront and decline reasons after the fact.

That said...we can give you good guidelines on FICO, monthly deposits, ending daily balance, and existing leverage where you'll see 70%+ average approval rates if you hit the guidelines.

Happy to discuss more 1:1 if you think it would be helpful.

contact me. Your UWs are extremely limited with their computer models. They dont understand simple invoicing and deposits for a merchant

[Michael I]

one of the big issue i have with bluevine is that if someone pays off completely and the next day they fund him you do not get paid . Most funders have a 30-90 day period where it will still be yours

[Chargers]

one of the big issue i have with bluevine is that if someone pays off completely and the next day they fund him you do not get paid . Most funders have a 30-90 day period where it will still be yours

Huh, Can you elaborate on this for me please?

[Michael I]

Huh, Can you elaborate on this for me please?

merchant borrows 100k pays it back fully with interest in a month. comes back 2 days later and they give him 100k iso gets paid zero . if he had any balance left even a hundred dollars than iso will be paid on the whole 100k.

[omegafund]

merchant borrows 100k pays it back fully with interest in a month. comes back 2 days later and they give him 100k iso gets paid zero . if he had any balance left even a hundred dollars than iso will be paid on the whole 100k.

that is a wrong practice, will have to check my pipeline.

[Kevin Henry-Seacoast]

merchant borrows 100k pays it back fully with interest in a month. comes back 2 days later and they give him 100k iso gets paid zero . if he had any balance left even a hundred dollars than iso will be paid on the whole 100k.

Wait... if they are under a financing contract with the client, why would they not pay the referral source? Even if the client paid down the facility to a zero balance and came back two weeks later for more funds under the same agreement you should get paid. It's not like they terminated the agreement with the customer and then entered a new agreement????

[abfunders]

Michael, did you experience this yourself?

It could very well be that the client does close the account and reopens with a new agreement. That's what we get for our world of computerized payouts from lenders with nothing more than sending them a link. It's got it's good points and its bad, what can I say?

I've had clients not draw for months and then Bluevine pays me out of the blue for a draw they made.

[Michael I]

Wait... if they are under a financing contract with the client, why would they not pay the referral source? Even if the client paid down the facility to a zero balance and came back two weeks later for more funds under the same agreement you should get paid. It's not like they terminated the agreement with the customer and then entered a new agreement????

on the line of credit,never did factoring with them