[jotucker1983]

So I had a general question to the DF Network. There's been a variety of changes taking place in the industry and I'm wondering, have any players gotten to the point of providing any real "true" MCA consolidations yet? If so, would anybody know who some of those players might be?

When I mention true consolidations, I'm referring to the practice of refinancing a merchant with a full approval who currently sits with multiple advance stacks, without the requirement of "netting" a particular amount at funding.

I haven't discovered (to this day) any real consolidation programs like this, other than perhaps an SBA loan. Would be interested to know if this is now available in some capacity where all advance positions can be refinanced or even perhaps maybe a 2nd and 3rd position can be consolidated (if that's even legal)?

Thanks.

[Big Mack]

WBL is the only one that comes to mind at this point in time. Of course, they'd need to leverage real estate equity.

[HDF]

Without giving anything away, I'd say that if your marketing is turning up a ton of stacked business owners, then I'd suggest perhaps adjusting your marketing to those that might specifically qualify for other products/solutions that can eliminate the issue rather quickly.

And don't forget Dan Page as well.

[WestCoastFunding]

Dan no longer does consolidations. Just hard money loans.

[HDF]

Dan no longer does consolidations. Just hard money loans.

This is true. Cash out non-primary residence or commercial can clean up the mess.

[Shorebird]

Good advice by HDF.

[Kevin Henry-Seacoast]

So I had a general question to the DF Network. There's been a variety of changes taking place in the industry and I'm wondering, have any players gotten to the point of providing any real "true" MCA consolidations yet? If so, would anybody know who some of those players might be?

When I mention true consolidations, I'm referring to the practice of refinancing a merchant with a full approval who currently sits with multiple advance stacks, without the requirement of "netting" a particular amount at funding.

I haven't discovered (to this day) any real consolidation programs like this, other than perhaps an SBA loan. Would be interested to know if this is now available in some capacity where all advance positions can be refinanced or even perhaps maybe a 2nd and 3rd position can be consolidated (if that's even legal)?

Thanks.

We have done them.... Below please find a link to a transaction we did for a Company in the South East.

https://seacoastbusinessfunding.com/...etain-profits/

[RichardGerard]

We arrange them as well John- at times using Institutional lenders and ABL groups like Kevin's (over $1M per month this year on consolidations).

If there are enough receivables, Machinery and equipment (and the entity is profitable- with good debtors), and/or desirable inventory there will always be a way to consolidate MCA advances.

Giving a client that has too many advances- a larger advance- in most instances is just piling on debt- even if the term is extended. If however the client took the quick- wrong debt, and has a good business- it will get done.

HDF brought up the old group Dan was affiliated with (Funding Strategy Partners). I have been working with the former Principal to fix non performing deals from their portfolio of loans outstanding- and many of them have solutions other than advances.

Sometimes more than one lender is needed (ie SeaCoast for the Asset based portion on a revolver and a term loan product to work side by side with them). It isn't easy or quick- but it happens all the time.

Richard 516 510 3855

rg@businesscapitalconsultants.com

[Lendvo]

So I had a general question to the DF Network. There's been a variety of changes taking place in the industry and I'm wondering, have any players gotten to the point of providing any real "true" MCA consolidations yet? If so, would anybody know who some of those players might be?

When I mention true consolidations, I'm referring to the practice of refinancing a merchant with a full approval who currently sits with multiple advance stacks, without the requirement of "netting" a particular amount at funding.

I haven't discovered (to this day) any real consolidation programs like this, other than perhaps an SBA loan. Would be interested to know if this is now available in some capacity where all advance positions can be refinanced or even perhaps maybe a 2nd and 3rd position can be consolidated (if that's even legal)?

Thanks.

We have actively done these at Lendvo for the last year +. They are not "easy" because usually merchants looking for this option have lots of other problems too. Please shoot us an email if you want to learn more on our consolidation program: support@lendvo.com .

[jotucker1983]

I wanted to bump this thread. Thanks to some of those that reached out. I haven't been able to find "exactly" what I'm looking for on this. Maybe more research is required, but I am looking for a solution that can technically consolidate advances without any required "net" amount at funding. The only thing I've found so far that's reasonable is:

- A Conventional Loan like a SBA Loan

- An Asset Based Loan using equipment or real estate

The problem with both of these products is that the merchant has to be very "clean" to get approval and that's just not the situation of these merchants.

I need a true MCA product that operates like this. Anybody know of anybody?

[jdlaw]

I believe both Fundworks and Breakout do true MCA Consolidationw with no net out, or minimal.

[WestCoastFunding]

I believe both Fundworks and Breakout do true MCA Consolidationw with no net out, or minimal.

Can’t imagine Fundworks not requiring a net. Usually when they buyout, it’s only for a single position with not much of a balance on it. You’ve seen them do differently?

[Kevin Henry-Seacoast]

I wanted to bump this thread. Thanks to some of those that reached out. I haven't been able to find "exactly" what I'm looking for on this. Maybe more research is required, but I am looking for a solution that can technically consolidate advances without any required "net" amount at funding. The only thing I've found so far that's reasonable is:

- A Conventional Loan like a SBA Loan

- An Asset Based Loan using equipment or real estate

The problem with both of these products is that the merchant has to be very "clean" to get approval and that's just not the situation of these merchants.

I need a true MCA product that operates like this. Anybody know of anybody?

Jo-We don't need the owner to be "clean". We have worked with challenged credits and owners with personal challenged credit.

[jdlaw]

The rep I talked to said they would just submitted file the am, so we'll find out.

[Karen37a]

Can’t imagine Fundworks not requiring a net. Usually when they buyout, it’s only for a single position with not much of a balance on it. You’ve seen them do differently?

No net consolidations are almost impossible because of the risk associated with doing it

you are buying out someones bad debt...not only the dollar amount sent to them but the "cost" or factor on the advance

There is no collateral on most ( and even if there was) to take someone up into the sky ...high dollar amount who showed no restraint before is not a smart idea

It can only be done under certain circumstances

The debt to Gross revenue would be the biggest determining factors...even then common sense

as a wide example... someone takes out ( just to make the numbers round) 50k to pay back 75k

50k pay back 75k
50k payback 75k
50k pay back 75k

They make 150k -200 a month

People cannot expect someone to "buy out" pay off

225 to pay back what? 300k

Why would it be ethical for the broker to recommend this with no net tangible benefit other than one payment? So you are going to pay 75k in additional costs to have one payment...no

[Karen37a]

Because Of what I just printed

If someone is in a First position I ethically recommend a second

example

take 20k ...instead of me paying off 80k make it 100 payback 140k ( that would mean you paid 40k to get 20k)

I would get way more commission on the second scenario ...but the isos with ethics take the 1st one and recommend the dreaded stack

When a client is so far out...he shouldn't be looking for more money. Put it in your 90-day pipeline and revisit him when his balances are lower


And when I am in first position i tell teh merchant ...don't beg me for 15 months then come back in 3 months asking for more money

take 6-12 and do not stack me

And that's the secret sauce ...ethics


( when brokers on your team go around this advice ....terminated instantly...now some of you are bragging that you have the terminated brokers - who have super clean backgrounds- sending deals to you.... have at it)

Anyone can create their own guidelines ...I do not like defaults

[Davincinc]

We have done them.... Below please find a link to a transaction we did for a Company in the South East.

https://seacoastbusinessfunding.com/...etain-profits/

Can you levergae 5-10 acres of land worth 7m?

[Kevin Henry-Seacoast]

Can you levergae 5-10 acres of land worth 7m?

We cannot use real estate as collateral.

[Karen37a]

Can you levergae 5-10 acres of land worth 7m?

If it has a structure on it ...even an outhouse...depending on the state..I know who can do it

pm me your number if you do not get an answer

[Karen37a]

You know whats worse than stacking someone 4-7 wide?

Being the last funder to the table so they can default on you for BIG money consolidation in one big SWOOSH or you watch them just stack again , and blame the next funder and brokers( because cheaters, cheat )

I warned some people trying to do this before...it can only be done under certain circumstances.

And some bankers ( not Kevin) ...I call them Loan to Own...they will make a bad loan on purpose to take the asset away..I've been on the back end collecting...thru huge meltdowns

unravelling the bs tranches and CDOs, derivatives

[Cfairbank]

No net consolidations are almost impossible because of the risk associated with doing it

Not if you know how to de-risk a customer, which most folks still aren’t doing. B2B we do them every day through factor advantage. we’ve done as many as 8 positions for 640k (zero net). Through factor advantage, weve proven we can give a 470 FICO with 8 open liens a 20s APR (not factor rate) loan.

[Karen37a]

Not if you know how to de-risk a customer, which most folks still aren’t doing. B2B we do them every day through factor advantage. we’ve done as many as 8 positions for 640k (zero net). Through factor advantage, weve proven we can give a 470 FICO with 8 open liens a 20s APR (not factor rate) loan.

yes...almost impossible

I can do it to..in certain cases

Problem is I do not like people who go out 5 6 7 positions( they make up millions of excuses), in my experience/observations they will stack you again...and then lie again ( my broker made me do it)50% of the will stack you again after promising not to do it , because they didnt fix the root cause of the monetary issues...cash flow...because their business sucks, they should have never become a 1099 business person...(just like most wont make it like sales.) 30 % will plunge under ...go out of business, (90 % of sales people are going to go under)
And then like sales they are going to blame everyone for not making cash flow $ and shutting down going out of business

I like to see people partially digging out of their own mess to show commitment to fixing their finances...when I see it, ill step in to help...don't see it...dodged a bullet. (It isnt just a numbers thing)


* tired of clients and merchants blaming brokers for their mess and people believe it, "no one stacked you...you stacked yourself, especially since you went to different brokers"

And this is great...all the people who have a tough time getting sales can send you all the consolidation, sometimes the reason they are meeting new brokers asking for a consolidation is because the other 8 cash advance brokers who are in position 1 ,2 ,3 4 5 678 said NO. When someone can go to anyone to get a cash advance or loan..you have to be on your game those people are harder to close.

( then this is how the regulation debates start which infuriates me..because I do not see those 5- 8 stacked people- unless brokers send it to me, or the pp ones. How do you even get the documents in? Id hang up on them lickity split...next. ps I know how lol )



*Dont forget some isos brokers will send you the deals so you can dig out the merchant so they can have room to stack you again...should have been in my office on that day of termination" who do you think I am...so and so...i can see what you are doing"

[Karen37a]

A light bulb will go off one day for people...The day they realize. "This is a business Loan or Advance"
Businesses have a finite timeline, most are out of business or sold etc in 10 years ..SBA Statistics
Personal loans...you are born, get credit you die...longer timeline

You can't stop some businesses from going under, they are just going to take some peoples money with them...and automation and regulation will not fix this


Why do small Businesses Close?
https://www.sba.gov/sites/default/fi...May_2018_0.pdf


And I think some 1099 salespeople have better insight into 1099 self-employed small to mid-size Business people...LLCs or inc( our clients)

[Cfairbank]

yes...almost impossible

I can do it to..in certain cases

Problem is I do not like people who go out 5 6 7 positions( they make up millions of excuses), in my experience/observations they will stack you again...and then lie again ( my broker made me do it)50% of the will stack you again after promising not to do it , because they didnt fix the root cause of the monetary issues...cash flow...because their business sucks, they should have never become a 1099 business person...(just like most wont make it like sales.) 30 % will plunge under ...go out of business, (90 % of sales people are going to go under)
And then like sales they are going to blame everyone for not making cash flow $ and shutting down going out of business

^^^ is why it's primarily a partnership driven product as the objective should be to provide the right (and that doesnt always mean cheapest, i get that) solution for their clients where the product mix is more than just cash flow based loans or advances. Unsecured loans that feature inconsistent disclosure, higher prices, and are set to cycle merchants over and over, you aren't "derisking" by consolidating -- but if you focus on customer risk (both willingness and ability to pay), for many many types of lending, credit issues and current cash flow can be made mostly irrelevant. There are so many financial products where credit, consolidation, or fat tail risk are mitigated, these companies (such as ours) can finance with confidence with the proper collateral or AR. This customer (if B2B) should not be taking a cash flow based loan or advance -- let your lender leverage their respective abilities' to use collateral to "de-risk" the customer and offer a sustainable loan. Are you assessing product suitability for each submission or just sending to cash flow lenders? are you offering leases and factoring? SBA? FactorAdvantage?

There are tons of different types of financial products, and if there isn't an element of suitability in where you send businesses, how are your customers being serviced properly?