Results 26 to 50 of 52
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05-03-2018, 01:35 PM #26
- Join Date
- Sep 2012
- Location
- New York, NY
- Posts
- 1,780
if a merchant is desperate enough to take 3rd and 4th positions, then the original funder would have been screwed anyway. At least he gets the benefit of lasting a little longer than if the merchant didn't take a stack.
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05-03-2018, 01:36 PM #27
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Posts
- 1,349
If you got your first position funded for "x" but you really needed "y" to resolve your issues as a merchant, are they really going to stop searching for additional funds? If a merchant got $20K because that specific funder had an UW matrix that funds a low % of gross sales, but really needed $40K, is it fair to handcuff the merchant and not allow them to obtain the necessary funding from someone else? I agree with some posts, its the 3rds on that seem to be questionable. Every deal is different. Each business has different margins, bank health etc. you can't generalize that ALL stacking impacts merchants in a negative manner.
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05-03-2018, 01:37 PM #28Karen37aGuest
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05-03-2018, 01:40 PM #29Karen37aGuest
Oh yeah what do I know...I am some dumb telemarketer
People have low defaults for a reason do not kid yourselves
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05-03-2018, 01:41 PM #30
Most business are not going to be able to survive when they get to the point that 20% or more of there revenue are going to pay back advances. Most of these stacking companies are taking merchants way past a 20% gross reserve. Merchant are doomed to fail when they get to that point
John Celifarco
Managing Partner
Horizon Funding Group
3423 Ave S
Brooklyn, NY 11234
T: (347) 773-3990 | F: (718) 795-1990
Linkedin: Profile
Email: john@horizonfundinggroup.com
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05-03-2018, 01:42 PM #31Karen37aGuest
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05-03-2018, 01:46 PM #32
what??? gross reserve doesnt change that much from month to month that can let a merchant sustain payment that take this much of their total revenue. I dont care the industry the merchant will eventually fail or default on his positions so he has the money to run his business
John Celifarco
Managing Partner
Horizon Funding Group
3423 Ave S
Brooklyn, NY 11234
T: (347) 773-3990 | F: (718) 795-1990
Linkedin: Profile
Email: john@horizonfundinggroup.com
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05-03-2018, 01:48 PM #33Karen37aGuest
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05-03-2018, 01:51 PM #34
- Join Date
- Jun 2017
- Posts
- 2,049
We just had a 16th Position
Multiple Banks, Big Volume
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05-03-2018, 02:03 PM #35John Celifarco
Managing Partner
Horizon Funding Group
3423 Ave S
Brooklyn, NY 11234
T: (347) 773-3990 | F: (718) 795-1990
Linkedin: Profile
Email: john@horizonfundinggroup.com
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05-03-2018, 02:03 PM #36
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- Jun 2017
- Posts
- 2,049
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05-03-2018, 02:05 PM #37
- Join Date
- Dec 2017
- Posts
- 397
first position funders who refinance their own balances at the same rates and terms, instead of offering a better add on product or credit increase, are just as bad as the stackers. refinance is the beginning of the end and every time a merchant refinances at 50% paid in, and multiplies their debt like that, they inevitably take a 2nd and or 3rd position within 60 days... happens every day
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05-03-2018, 02:07 PM #38
- Join Date
- Feb 2018
- Posts
- 1,349
is there a study that has been done per SIC, what the max gross pull should be, on a macro level. what factual evidence do we have that states what a salon, auto repair, restaurant, manufacturer, dentist, etc can handle in repayment. does the onerous lie with the business owner on what they can handle? some funders cap 4-14% of gross on first pos based on industry and other metrics. some low offers actually activate the stacking because of the shortage of funds received on first, or, when renewals forces a merchant to wait 50-60% paid down, but an emergency occurs, and they need a quick injection that day and can't wait 2-3 more months. a lot of variables in play here as to why stacking has become part of this business.
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05-03-2018, 02:07 PM #39John Celifarco
Managing Partner
Horizon Funding Group
3423 Ave S
Brooklyn, NY 11234
T: (347) 773-3990 | F: (718) 795-1990
Linkedin: Profile
Email: john@horizonfundinggroup.com
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05-03-2018, 02:11 PM #40
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- Feb 2018
- Posts
- 1,349
that was the core model for several of the largest mca's in this space. refinancing vs add ons. it made them a lot of money. now that the space is crowded and more information is available for business owners out there, that model has been challenged. double dipping is not helping a business owner. do the ben franklin of a double dip vs a second positon and you will see the logic
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05-03-2018, 02:15 PM #41
- Join Date
- Feb 2017
- Posts
- 3,455
John, some merchants actually survive an MCA experience.
I've seen it several times. One with 4 positions, back to business as normal. One with OnDeck for a year, they got where they wanted, and started hunting for something better. Clients who have an Amazon loan and they can turn $1 into $1.50 over 3 months, so an MCA is all they have access to.
There are many people here who have re-fi'ed MCAs into something more manageable, by getting them an SBA or LOC/term-loan blend, on the tail end of a series of them, which is what I'm presently involved with on with some very large files.
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05-03-2018, 02:16 PM #42
- Join Date
- Sep 2012
- Location
- New York, NY
- Posts
- 1,780
I agree with this but unfortunately these stories aren't too common. A lot of them end up going out of business. Try calling a UCC list from a few years ago and tell me how many disconnected numbers you find...
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05-03-2018, 02:18 PM #43
I 100% agree, I have tons of merchants who have taken 1 or even a first and second and used it to turn huge profits. My point is when you get to 3rds and higher positions then that in most cases, not all but most merchant is just taking position after position to stay afloat or to be able to pay the positions they have open already. I think the amount of success stories for people whop have taken excessive stacks are probably very very small
John Celifarco
Managing Partner
Horizon Funding Group
3423 Ave S
Brooklyn, NY 11234
T: (347) 773-3990 | F: (718) 795-1990
Linkedin: Profile
Email: john@horizonfundinggroup.com
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05-03-2018, 02:24 PM #44
- Join Date
- Dec 2017
- Posts
- 397
sales people can't do math or look at things from a different perspective, that's why i'm making a killing stacking like pancakes
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05-03-2018, 02:26 PM #45
- Join Date
- Dec 2017
- Posts
- 397
the majority of merchants who have taken 3rd and 4th, are the same merchants who elected to refinance their balances in the past from a so called good first position lender and they never catch up from that Refi decision, and it becomes a revolving door of open advances after that.... i'm just playing devils advocate here, i like stacking, i like clients that renew their first positions too but i see fault on both sides
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05-03-2018, 02:52 PM #46
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- Jul 2014
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- Online
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- 965
Amanda Kingsley
DailyFunder: WhoisKingsley
This is me. https://www.facebook.com/whoiskingsley
I am Here too. https://www.facebook.com/groups/TheClosersGroup
Always Live and Lead with Integrity.
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05-03-2018, 02:52 PM #47
- Join Date
- Dec 2013
- Posts
- 4,713
FYI: I love 1st position Subprime files...we have a big (or as our #1 would say HUGHHHHH) portfolio of 1sts!
Marcus Clapman | Business Development | Cresthill Capital
(High Commissions Payout Group)
覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧覧
Tel: 917-521-6528 | Fax: 212.671.1473
Email: bizdev@cresthillcapital.com
http://www.cresthillcapital.com
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05-03-2018, 03:03 PM #48
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- Mar 2017
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- Nunya
- Posts
- 830
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05-03-2018, 03:05 PM #49
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05-03-2018, 03:36 PM #50
- Join Date
- Oct 2016
- Posts
- 4,318
If you aren’t an actual bank, chances are you’re stacking someone. All the 1st position funders are more than willing to ‘stack’ on a SBA or bank loan.
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